Who Would Decide What To Separate?
Posted: Saturday, July 12, 2008
by Mr. Keith
IChooseThin
Today I live in the Southern BIble Belt and have studied with The Catholics, The Baptists, The Mormons, The Jehovah Wittinesses and a few other church organizations. The one overriding and supreme thought of each and every church I had the privilege of being with was that they were the "true" church and all others were wrong. What wrong meant was that if I were not a member of "that" church I was going to Hell. As I sit back and reflect of all those years of study I have had an evolving opinion of what the Separation of Church and State really means.
Fast forward to 1985 to a small southern town that myself and a close friend stopped for a meal. I am a white man and my dear friend was/is a black man. To take the mental description a step further my friend and myself were dressed in United States Marine Corps Officer uniforms. I do not remember where we were driving to I just remember stopping in a small town corner restaurant. As we waited for a waitress I noticed that people were coming and going and getting their food while we sat unattended. After quite awhile I asked the woman behind the counter if we could have some menus. I remember her answer to this day with vivid reflection. She yelled out that "we don't serve no niggers and white trash". In a moment I was smacked with a prejudice I have never experienced before. My friend grabbed me by the arm when he noticed my anger and pulled me from the building. I was fighting mad and later he convinced me that if I would have fought, the best we could have hoped for was a spot in jail with a conviction for some crime that I would have been charged with having committed. Here was evidence of Law being openly violated and accepted by the very people who uphold the Law because a Deputy was eating at a table across the room.
My life has proven to me that bigotry is alive and well. My church attendance has proven to me that ALL churches discriminate against other churches purely through their doctrine. My daily life has proven to me that people are to be feared. A Black man may be my friend, but a Black man can do me harm. A Muslim can hurt me but can also be my friend. A Spanish man can take my job yet I can still work side by side with a friend who is Spanish. I have learned to fear the group and not the person.
As we decide whether or not we need to have a separation between Church and State we need to realize that all organizations are ruled by people. Those people will decide which Church and which State will be separated from which organization. As we make our opinions be known we are really only echoing those beliefs of what we have learned through our existence in society. That society has taught us that there is a devil and yet we doubt there is a God. That society has taught us that we must pay our taxes yet those taxes are crippling the stability of the economic base of America itself.
The need for a separation is evident in the fact that organizations cannot be trusted to make the decisions that will affect our life. Separation has to be total and complete and never be allowed to compromised. The reason for this separation is evident in the fact that this nation of laws has been violating laws since before it's birth. I want the law of the land to not tell me what I can and what I cannot do in every corner of my life. I want less law because I know that behind those laws are people with an agenda. If a law were to be passed that forbid the separation of Church and State how far it would go and what loopholes would be used to circumvent the law itself?
Separation of Church and State is a necessary evil because without it there are only more ways for society to force it's members to march to society's agenda. The law itself needs to be simple. No tax dollars are to be used to support a Church of any kind. Without money those churches can do as they please until they cause harm on someone. That harm would then be a violation of another law and that would be another matter. This is not to say we ignore religion, we just do not allow one religion to gain a toehold in law.
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Top-level comments on this article: (3 total)hi mr. keith,
feeling a little fiesty these days, huh?
this was a well written, well thought out, interesting article.
i'm so enthralled in my daily life, i don't tend to think about what i just read. thanks for sharing it,
best regards,
sueI vent through the articles I write but in my daily life I do not worry much about what I write. My life is so full of woek, family and my websites that I have little time for else. I really do enjoy writting though.Thanks again!!!!Keith
Mr. Keith,
This was an interesting piece. I’m sure you are aware that our Founding Fathers shared your distrust of people. This is fundamental to the government system they devised. They believed no one man could be trusted with absolute power. They even believed that a majority of the population could not be trusted to make right decisions. Thus, we have a system of checks and balances.
Our nation’s founders held a biblical worldview, evidenced in their many documents. The Declaration of Independence refers to their common belief that the ultimate Authority in the world is not any man or men but God, the Creator. His laws trump all human laws – whether of church or state. Sometimes human laws allow things God forbids and sometimes forbid things God allows or even advocates. We are ONLY bound to obey God’s laws. Christ’s Apostles expressed this view when ordered by the religious authorities not to teach about Jesus anymore. They said, “Judge for yourselves whether it is right for us to obey you or God” (Acts 4:19).
Like many people in our land, legitimately confused by the different denominations, you seem to have decided that the government needs to be protected from our confusion. I know that the Popes will be surprised to see me in heaven. There was a time when I would have been surprise to see any of them there, too. But Scripture says, “the Lord knows those who are His” (2 Tim 2:19). Furthermore, it tells us that, in the end, He is the One to whom “we must all give account” (Heb 4:13).
The differences between the denominations are not nearly as great as you suggest. Very few of us believe that OUR group is the only group, and you are “going to hell” if you aren’t part of our group. The moral views of the denominations are probably 90% in agreement. That we interpret the Bible differently should surprise no one. We have nine Supreme Court Justices that are routinely split 5-4 on what the authors of our Constitution meant by what they wrote. And every time a new Justice is to be appointed, all hell breaks loose. Why? Because we want Justices who will interpret it the way we want it interpreted. I admit you can find that same mindset in many churches regarding the Bible.
All of that said, the common interpretation that the “separation of church and state” was ever meant to bind religious people from having a voice in the laws of the land is wrong. I suppose every government prefers some religion, even if it be NO religion. I believe our nation suffers because the preferred religion of the land has shifted from Christianity to that of secular humanism.
Thank you for the comment as I am glad peopel such as yourself find what I write.You actually supported what I said in what you wrote. In your own writting you made my point and did not even realize you had done it. That is because most people who are deep into their religion really do not listen to what they are being told.You wrote, and I quote " I know that the Popes will be surprised to see me in heaven" . My question is why do you KNOW you are going to heaven? If I were a Muslim and you were a Mormon you would not make it. If you are a Baptist and I was Jewish, I would not be going to your heaven.I will bet you a dougnut that if you went to the CORE of your church's doctrine you will see I am right. I am not speaking of what makes you "warm and fuzzy" I am speaking of "doctrine". Because of your doctrine you KNOW you will be in heaven and the Pope will be surprised to see you.I make no apoligizes but I want no part of a government that includes doctrine in its policy. MOrals are one thing, doctrine is another.Thank you for making my point.
Mr. Keith another interesting article that stirs the thought process. I noticed many are writing to the same topic. Yes who is going to heaven and who isn't? That will be all cleared up at the end one way or the other, if there is an end? Well who is right or who is wrong? Also satisfied at the end, if there is one? Is black, really black or is it white? What is good or not? For now we must deal with man, their views, beliefs, interpretations. Yes, I'm right your wrong [of course] The separation of man is endless. In fact Jesus Himself said, for believers, is that he came to separate so why would at least Christians be confused over this? That is why "religion" has no place in politics when it is used to Evangelize or imposes religious belief onto others. Moral, ethical, who says so? It must be society of we get anarchy. However, we cannot escape that what you believe is for the most part in my opinion the root that shapes decisions. Indoctrination, influence, surroundings, culture, education, church, traditions, family, friends, people, etc all shapers. What you wind up with is your beliefs at the time a decision or choice must be made. However the one constant in my opinion that we never seem to learn, the one universal fact that never seems to be understood is that without love you have nothing. If you experienced love that day in the restaurant the situation never happens. If you have love you never argue about right or wrong, you never hurt, abuse, take or exploit, you respect. That is in my opinion what gets one through those pearly gates, if they are there and are they really pearls? That is in my opinion what most of us can accept as good decisions or bad. It is all about what you do and fail to do. Hey but who am I and here we go again. Best wishes.Thank you for a well thought out and intelligent comment. It was a pure pleasure for me read your words.
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